U vs ROB -- Who has the Edge ?

The situation you were in, once she was willing to take it to management rather than accept your offer, was one in which you had no control. You could have refused to pay more than a certain amount (as you did), and they could have tossed you for no reason other than it's their choice. You ended up at the mercy of the manager, and it sounds like he tried not to lose a customer and not to make the dancer face any consequence for trying to rip you off. Probably about the best result you could expect.

It seems the ROB had and imo usually has the advantage. I'm concern you that thought it was 4 songs and the bouncer calculated 8 songs.

At the $5 clubs it is often a probably that it is by design purposely difficult to hear when a song begins and ends---but, it sounds the the same game is played at more expensive clubs.

how: I certainly agree with you and realized that this club did not and does not want tgo lose this customer. I also wanted to put this ROB on notice that she will be under additional scrutiny with her tactics.

I did need to see how club management would respond in this situation and whether they would "cave-in" to the ROB or consider the tenure ( and character ) of the customer. It did appear to be about the best result I could expect. Thanks for responding and hearing me out.

jablake: The # of songs played matters less than the tactics of dancer to ripoff the customer. Had I been intoxicated, unruly and/or unknown; it could have been more detrimental. I viewed this as "Dancer-specific," as opposed to a change in club tactics. And thank you for sharing your opinion.

ds: It seems to me that it may well be "ROB" management just as much as "ROB Dancer" in your scenario (eg garbage techno songs with indefinite beginings/ends). The obvious "hope" being that they'll squeeze more money from you. I guess the solution would be to be proactive early on- if you find yourself in that spot, say after 5-10 minutes- ask dancer "how many songs have we done so far"? I've experienced the techno garbage at 2 different clubs in last 2 yrs. In 1 case count was satisfactory, in another, somewhat equivocal. In the 1st case, I was sorta regular, in 2nd case, and infrequent tourist type. CAVEAT EMPTOR!!!

Hi dennyspade,

It is difficult, imo, to just change clubs. That is another advantage the ROB has. I feel fortunate that at Angels everytime that I've complained management has taken my side. I don't complain often because it is a real downer and usually the "heist" is small.

Minnow makes a very good point. And, if she is telling you 11 dances and the bouncer is counting 8, then good management would be all over her for attempting to get a few extra songs. Management should be thanking you assuming she also told them 11 dances.

In a free market the customer is generally KING, imo, but it isn't a free market.

I always - ALWAYS - specify the number of dances I'll have beforehand; I've never had the ROB issue doing that.

That said, the ROB has the advantage because you're one her turf - the club. While in normal retail the customer is king, the people who work in clubs are frankly not very smart business people, by and large - the concept of customer service escapes them.

I just make sure I take control as much as possible by specifying what I want at the outset. Seems to work.

O.

I do because 95% of the dances I get are from dancers that I know well. On the rare occasions that I try a dancer new to me, I make sure we are on the same page. $$$ VS mileage. Have I ever fucked up and got a ROB? YES. I don't mention dancer names in my reviews unless they piss me off. When They do, they get my "Bitch of the month award". Current dancers on my shit list are Megan, Eden and Sydney. Keep the big head clear and in charge.

I doubt that I would do it, but this one customer asked me if a particular dancer was a ROB. My thought at the time was that his asking me was unusual. Apparently, I looked like a regular and he was new in town and didn't want to get stolen from. He had no problem spending money or even premium prices, but he wanted the dancer to keep her word.

Turned out that I did know the dancer, but had never bought a single dance from her. As things turned out both the customer and dancer were happy with me, which was very nice that they were happy with each other.

The man was financially successful. Perhaps his willingness to ask was one reason for his business success. So, he created an edge by asking someone who he believed had experience at the club. Maybe it was my age. Or, maybe the way I act with the dancers. Or, my clinging to every last dollar as if it was my last. Bottom line he wanted to improve his chances before spending a few hundred dollars, but he also made clear it wasn't the money as much as theft that upset him.

For the record, even after years of experience I can sometimes be taken by a ROB. Usually, I just prefer to lose X amount of money rather than get into a confrontation. One thing the courts as well as good police officers have taught me is that being in right just isn't good enough. Really work to avoid confrontations (at least in my area of the country) because that is preferred choice.

The revenge fantasy goes like this: Get a group of guys for a club outing at this club. Take a booth, ordering drinks and buying dances, making sure she is excluded and gets nothing. Don't say anything to her or about it. When other dancers are enjoying your party, she will know how badly she fucked up. Of course this may not be possible or may not be your style.

Generally, its the ROB who has the edge in this case.

I had something of a similar scenario at my most recent outing, except in the end, I didn't have to pay as much as I could have. It helped my current favorite at that club was my chosen dancer at that point. I had one song in the VIP and then the club had their nightly "all girls to the stage" event (they have a specific name for it, but I forget it at the moment), which involved giving dollar dances to patrons and then the dude (or lady!) she's with on the last song (they do 5 clips of songs) has to strip for the lady. Generally, this goes on for 10 minutes, but that whole period was just one song. I ended up paying for two songs, but it could have been more. Then again, my favorite thinks they charge too much as it is.

Reminds me of when I was in London and their so called strip clubs. I sat down with a girl and we had a drink. She gave a vague description of what services cost and after hearing of the rip off prices I told I would pass. She then informed me I owed her $120 for our sit down chat. I told her to fuck off at which to she motioned to her two hit men and they came over and told me that in the best interest of my health that I better fork over the money. I did and left. Had the same type of experience in Paris.

Contrast that with my experience yesterday. Yesterday I went to one of my favorite clubs and met up with one of my favorites. We made out for 30 minutes at the bar. We then went to the stage for 15 minutes and had plenty of skin to skin contact. Then we went and had sex in the private (15 minutes) and it cost me $120 and I was there for over an hour. What is that 15 songs worth of time, but we never count songs. Since I’ve seen her before money was never discussed. If I would have given her $80 or $90 she would have been just as pleasant and thankful as she was with the $120.

"Reminds me of when I was in London and their so called strip clubs. I sat down with a girl and we had a drink. She gave a vague description of what services cost and after hearing of the rip off prices I told I would pass. She then informed me I owed her $120 for our sit down chat. I told her to fuck off at which to she motioned to her two hit men and they came over and told me that in the best interest of my health that I better fork over the money. I did and left. Had the same type of experience in Paris."

This is why some strip clubs burn down.

Anyhow, the ROB always has the advantage. Don't fool one's self.

People will take a chance and steal when they feel they have the upper hand. To do otherwise would be foolish. Who wants to get caught?

Depends whether you're comfortable just walking out and saying, "No way am I gonna pay that much." If you fear that the bouncers will beat you up to demand your money, or if you ever need to go back to that same club ever again in your life, then she has the advantage. If not, and you reasonably know that you can get away with abandoning the situation with impunity, then you have the advantage whenever she tries bullshit like that.

I encourage my TUSCL brothers to be more proactive about resisting bullshit. We're the customer. They can't possibly continually abuse us. Most decent dancers will talk it through, accept a compromise, anything to avoid a scene -- probably because, whether OR NOT you storm out in a huff, she'll get the shit kicked out of her by the same bouncers for HER part in the mess, whether or not she's in the wrong. So, she just wants it all to go away.

Then again, there are the queen-bee scamming bitches at certain clubs who just can't resist breaking rules and getting away with it, screwing over customers, and making sure the bouncers and managers eat out of their hands too. Those women should be avoided. They're bad at private dances anyway, and they're likely blowing about 3/4 of the staff to stay in their good graces.