To Mind My Own Business or Not . . .

Did the rookie thank you and buy you a beer. He should have. You did the right thing. Dancers assume that guys won't help other guys and that they can get away with anything. Now she has to stay straight on the count and other things. Think of all of the guys in the future you have saved from rip-offs.

In a strip club, a lot of normal society stays outside, IMHO. Does "society" her her anything, not THIS "society"! 10 will get you 100, that most any problem she has was self induced!

Hi SuperDude,

No, he thanked me a few times and was very happy though still "recovering" i.e. that rip-off came from left field. I may have saved other guys from rip-offs at that club from that one dancer. (Heck, I even still get ripped off "small" amounts sometimes--but, I think that I'm to blame for not being "stronger" or whatever.) In a $5 club it is a little bit of the Wild West like the customer pointed out so who knows what will happen next.

The final chapter or chapters still haven't been written. I don't want to see her go and I doubt the manager or other dancers want to see her go. Having said that payback against me is not out of the question. She may "fight back" without warning at who knows what future date. She may see me as a horrible person and part of the system.

Perhaps worse it may just transfer and or increase the problem else where and to someone else. She has a chip on her shoulder that for me at least was very easy to see. The "rookie" didn't see it even a little bit.

If I had perceived the customer in a negative light, then I most likely wouldn't have done anything. Of course, she might not have tried anything and if she did she could be in for a rude awakening depending on what type of negative the customer is.

Hi clubber,

Most of her problems may have been self-induced depending on how you look at that and what the facts of the case are. Her personality is to "fight back." There is that old tangle web we weave story, which sometimes works out in reality. The very good message being don't take the wrong road even if at first it doesn't seem so bad because one thing can lead to another to another to something really terrible.

It can work in positive reverse too. :) A person can do a good deed for me and then I will remember that and not only return the favor if possible, but be more willing to care and help other people.

It also works in negative reverse. :( I get screwed by the courts, then I become very negative and distrustful. If someone needs my help that involves stopping a real crime (for example a van is being ripped-off in front of the owner), then I may figure gee it wouldn't take too much for me to stand up to the theif. In fact, that would be my knee jerk reaction. Try and stop the crime and help the victim. That poor victim may not be able to afford the loss of his van that is being stolen right in front of his eyes. The police aren't going to arrive in time most likely and the victim isn't in a position to do anything. Oops, there is a real complication at least in my mind. The system is extremely bad, ime, and getting involved not only brings risk to me (if the risk was just from the criminal that isn't going to slow me down in that one case even a little) from the system (yes, you definitely place yourself at risk even just being a good samaritan and returning a purse LOL!), but far worse is the risk to the criminal. Sounds twisted doesn't it? And, it should. :) After all the criminal choose his lot by stealing a van that didn't belong to him. He deserves whatever punishment is dealt out by the courts. Does he? Whatever punishment? even if it included chopping his hands off or perhaps 20 years in prison? Some people would easily say YES!!! To those people not only wouldn't I want to stop the theif, but heck I'd be rooting for him! :)

Anyway, it appeared that the victim lost his van. Who knows how much it really hurt him if in fact he ultimately lost the van. There could have been a child left in the van for god's sakes!!! :( Who knows and besides "I should mind my own business" "don't burden others." The victim sure as hell will never know that it all could turned out probably much more positively at least for him. The van and its contents would most likely have been immediately back in his possession. Of course, you never know how willing a criminal is to fight back, but he appeared scared to death----just of the owner! LOL! :)

Anyway, do I feel bad about that? Yes. Would I do things differently if I had another chance? No. In the future will I come to the rescue if capable? To save someone's property HELL NO if it will lead to contact with the system and that might be the correct course of action even if the system was wonderful. The old let the police handle it. :)

For one thing, I would have thought it was creepy that another guy was counting my dances.

I think it's best to stay out of other people's business unless they ask you to get involved. Especially in a strip club, where I would hope that a busybody can't tell everything that has taken place as well as the participants themselves. Moreover, a rookie can learn better from his mistakes on his own, and whatever few bucks he loses is the small price of his experience. And a stripper who cheats customers will get her comeuppance in time.

Hi chandler,

I would agree that about the creepy part. :) But, she with her "chip on her shoulder" combined with the approach by the rookie combined with with her very sensual dances had me ALL EYES. :) And, I was counting the dances because I wanted to approach her for dances since she was doing such a good job. Yes, you might not think that makes sense. But, if I see something special I will start counting to get some idea when they might be done. The record so far is something like 22 dances! LOL! Yes, I counted and enjoyed watching and I grabbed her as soon as she was finished. She actually said she needed to clean up first and then gave me the same type dances. :) She didn't last long unfortunately.

Oops, I wanted to address the creepy part and so forgot about the rest of the post!

Very interesting and good points. Glad it wasn't as clear cut among posters as I thought it would be! :)

Jablake: Cautionary note--Car thieves are sometimes armed. In Detroit it's easy to get shot trying to stop the theft of a motor vehicle.

Use a club-style steering-wheel lock. Yes, people CAN get through it, eventually, but it's such a deterrent (especially on anything other than the latest of late-model expensive cars) that the perp is more likely to just walk on down the block to find an easier mark.

Better yet? Drive a 1996 Honda Accord with dinged up windshield. Fill it with old boxes of clothing and diapers.

Hi SuperDude,

I was watching the game unfold in slow motion and positioned myself to get the drop if necessary. I was in my car in the parking lot and I noticed the thief because of his body language as he was walking toward the van. Like the stripper with the "chip on her shoulder," I notice certain behaviour that is just a "little" different or suspicious. The van was locked and out comes the slim jim and it was like WOW! that was smooth (he did have some trouble getting the van started--only at the "last" moment did it turn over). At this point it was like do I want to get involved? And, the answer is NO, however, I'm going to watch it unfold just in case there is the unlikely event things go bad--like the owner showing up. I'm armed and actually although I've been normally well treated by the police my faith in the system is way below zero. Also, it is difficult for most people to understand . . . if the police treat you well 18 or 19 times out of 20 that really isn't too good! (Hint: If the police say you're guilty, then pray for a good plea deal.) Like I had told one officer, "I'm going to get a fair trial in America?" Surprisingly, he didn't think I would. But, it didn't make any difference because of course I was guilty in his opinion and I in "theory" was guilty of "technical" violations (felonies), but nothing in the moral sense and truly the officer didn't care about the "technicals" (and there were "racial" problems even though I'm white). Those (technicals) were just a means to an ends. Anyway, I was far more concerned with the police than with some potentially armed car thief. And, if I was pro-active instead of hoping the van owner didn't show then it is a relatively easy situation. Over confident, yes, but still very wary. If I believe in the courts, then I will act and hopefully the thief doesn't force me to fire. Anyway, good courts or bad courts I can see it argued that you have NO business "taking the law into your own hands." LOL! :) I was brainwashed when young to do unto others as you would have them do unto you or something like that. So, I really wanted to do the "right" thing . . . the "right" thing being what I would want someone to do if I was the van owner, which would be STOP the thief with minimal force.

BTW, obeying the law isn't necessarily the "right" thing, imo. Many people can't comprehend that.

As far as the dancer, I was turned off from getting the dances that I had planned to buy. Now, I'm thinking some dance purchases if she is available and willing might help smooth things over and help her think more positively. :) Not too bright? :)

Although I think there are good arguments both ways, the more I think about it I'd probably again be a "busybody" under similar circumstances. The old "do unto others as you would have them do unto" rule especially where there isn't a substantial risk that there will be police and courts and lawyers and etc.

I believe her theft hurts the other dancers in the pocket book. Customers not feeling as free to just let the songs roll or buy them in the first place.

And, I think it hurts the dancers as far as work environment. The customers, many of them, are bad enough without potentially increasing and creating more abusive customers. And, some of the dancers at Angels have expressed a belief that the actions of one dancer can effect them all negatively---the one dancer can't just think what is best for her, iows. She needs to think about the larger context.

SuperDude already explained how it may protect future customers. Of course, the argument that the normal rules of society don't apply in a stripclub is true to a certain extent, but those rules aren't dumped entirely, imo. Overcounting dances or doubling the price after the fact doesn't, imo, have any special protected status in a stripclub nor can I see why it should be protected. It seems to be an overall negative for both customers and dancers.

The customer DID appreciate my being a "busybody" and if he didn't then more likely than not I would just consider him amusing. I can see him saying "How dare you watch my dances." Hello buddy, you don't wish to be observed in the public area there VIP rooms and also more discrete areas of the club. :)

Hopefully, things will work out ok between me and the "injured" dancer. :)

jablake,

A simple question for you. Is it possible for you to type a relatively short and concise answer?

Hi clubber,

Every once in a while I do. :)

Jablake,

I'm sure you didn't learn your mind reading skills from me. But in that instance you shown that you could act like you have a sack.

A side note: Now that you have mastered the concise answer, can you try to go for one fucking day without mentioning that the justice system was designed to screw jayblake? That shit is getting old.

Intervene? Yes, tell your version of the story. But then expect EITHER side to respect you afterwards? No. Just as with making romantic matches between your friends, it's nothing but an inevitability that you'll come out the loser in both directions.

I don't follow "is from the prisons ... society owes her a debt." What does this comment mean?