Black Virginia homeowner shot White kid ding dong ditching at 3am

There's a FAFO element to this (dying for a TikTok challenge = natural selection), but the usual race hustlers are already on their way to West Virginia.
Castle Doctrine doesn't mean you have a right to shoot anyone on your property.
It would be different if the kid were trying to break in.

Bigots are trying to bait this as racially motivated black on white crime.
In reality the racial element comes into play regarding how quickly Butler was arrested and how quickly the media jumped on it.
3 men were knocking on his door at 3am and wouldnt leave.... Not sure what most would do.

The more I read about the case. The more trumped up the charges look. 3 teens were banging on the door. Kicking it. Ringing the doorbell. Also doing it at the garage door. Butler called the police reporting an attempted burglary.
The DA claims a prank doesnt justify deadly force to protect property. There was no way for Butler to know it was supposedly a prank.

There was no mention of “wouldnt leave”… thats speculation…
Theres not even confirmation on whether they were knocking, knocked once, or just rung the bell one or more times…

It also may have only been one person who did the knocking or bell ringing

Its not impossible that the homeowner was overly aggressive or violent

There were people arguing that even guys like rayshard brooks or jacob blake were unfairly shot by cops…

Also the thing is even if they actually broke a window, all of that is meaningless if they were shot while running away.

Per the michael drejka case in florida, even in a stand your ground state, once someone retreats, even taking a half a step back, you can no longer shoot them unless they are actively charging towards you

So if he shot the kid while the kid was running away, it would be 2nd degree murder

It was caught on security cameras

So the homeowner actually called and reported the kids attempting burglary after he already shot them.

Meanwhile both kids who survived claimed they were doing ding dong ditch pranks for TikTok- one of the kids was able to pull up other ding dong ditch pranks they previously filmed on his phone.

I think the guy is screwed unless theres good proof the kids were trying to break in

The article is light on the facts.
Where did he shoot them? What were the kids doing when he shot at them?
You can't shoot through a door, at least not in Mass, the rationale being you could shoot a cop or an innocent without knowing who it was.
If they were just "banging, kicking, and slamming on a garage door," that's not enough.
If they were an imminent threat to break in or charging him or brandishing a weapon of their own, it could be justified.
If it's all on camera, it might not be much of a trial.
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State law also matters.
Up here, a firearms lawyer told me you could shoot someone who is in the act of beating the shit out of a loved one, and you'd be at very least arrested, with a prosecutor who wants to rape you for the simple fact that they used a gun.
In Texas, you can practically shoot someone for looking at you funny. I saw a clip where a gun owner shot a store robber three times, then when the robber was down, delivered a point-blank execution shot to the head, and got away with it.

Butler called the cops when the 3 men started banging on his door at 3am. They clailm they were trying to get into his garage to hide. As part of the "prank". There is video evidence. Them saying it was a prank after the facts is irrelevant. Instead of trying to get into his property they could have yelled that its a prank when he came out with a weapon. They didnt.

The media is already attacking Butler's character. He had charges against him for posting revenger porn. And the possible burglars are made out to be innocent little kids.

There was a case in Vegas a few months back when a man called 911 because his ex broke in and attacked him with a knife. When the cops came they saw him pleading for help while she stabbed him. The cop shot and killed the black man. Viewing his female attacker as the victim. Nothing happened to the cop.

Here we have a black man automatically charged with murder after 3 white men tried to get into his property at 3 am. refusing to leave or say anything.

Do you have a source for where he reported a burglary in progress? If its something someone posted on twitter its meaningless.

Even on the washington post this is what it says
“ The sheriff’s office said the person who made the emergency call reported a resident had fired shots after three people tried to kick down a door. Authorities did not publicly identify the caller.”

So whoever made the phone call did so after shots were already fired.
Its true that the making a TikTok video could be an excuse given by the teens, but they had video proof showing they had filmed similar TikToks before.

On the other hand Butler appears to be making things up when he claims robbery in progress. Everyone knows you can shoot someone breaking into a house, but that doesnt mean thats actually what happened.

Do you have the name of the guy involved in the Vegas incident so we can look it up? As far as that sort of situation it all comes down to who a reasonable person would see is the attacker. I can see your point that there could be biases at play, where some people will assume the black guy is the aggressor or the guy is the aggressor in an incident with a woman. But we would need the name of the guy to look into it further.

The thing is even if that case was the cops messing up or being racist, it has nothing to do with this case, nor is it evidence that cops or courts systemically make the same mistakes.

As far as your last point, there were never 3 white men. The other 2 white kids were under 18. They also never refused to leave or refused to say anything.

Im curious to hear your thoughts on the cannon hinnant situation? This case, at least for now, has some unknown information so you can pretend the kids were possibly trying to break in. But im curious on your thoughts on cannon hinnant, do you think that was a justified situation?

Now youre just making shit up to troll.

We've got two racist trolls going at it. I've got my popcorn.

Says the racist troll who thinks bringing up racist policing and media reporting is discriminatory against bigots

^ The article doesn't mention race, dumbass. You're just flame-baiting again, chunkyflacko.

What 18 year old goes playing Ding Dong Ditch at 3am? I blame the parents for raising these "kids" to be little shits running around the neighborhood wreaking havoc under the guise of "it's just a game! It was a prank!" There's probably a Black Mirror episode that tackles this issue of people being so desperate for social media attention that they get killed over it. If not, there should be.

^ This is the biggest problem that the left needs to fix to win elections. The defense of the indefensible and their tendency to pick the stupidest causes to defend to the death, like gays for Palestine.

1. Keep voting for corporate democrats and wanting to compromise with the far right.

I don't know all the details here. From what I've read,

1. One of the surviving teenagers produced a video of them actually playing DDD earlier in the night, as per the TikTok challenge.

2. A neighbor's surveillance video showed the teens kicking and banging into the neighbor's garage door before the shooting took place. So they were doing more than just playing Ding Dong Ditch by the time the event took place. It's easy to assume people attempting to kick in your door at 3AM are doing something nefarious, and attempting to kick a door down is not a part of Ding Dong Ditch.

3. The incident happened in the back of the house, not the front as normal "DDD" would be played. Allegedly, the man shot through/at his own door. This is alleged - I don't know if the teens were shot at while actually trying to kick in the door, or after they got caught and started running.

So it is obvious these 17 and 18 year olds were doing more than just ringing a doorbell. I think this will come down to where the bullet is on the body and what the actual crime scene looked like.

Hm. Those points were supposed to be numbered.

It wasn't just gays for Palestine btw, the Palestinian single-issuers are one of the dumbest voting blocs in existence.

@Nina - You don't need Black Mirror. Some other dumbass kids jumped in front of someone at night with a raised butcher knife. Blam. Pretty sure they were white.

Also, you can't shoot through a door. At least not in Massachusetts. Like I said above, this article is light on specifics.

@25 - Dems could win in 26/28 if they could strike the correct populist note. Instead they have AOC might be called populist but jumps in front of every woke cause the minute it turns popular. And Jasmine Crockett with her fake ghetto inflections and potty mouth. And they're still under the hallucination that they lost 24 because they didn't market their positions well enough.

That’s far from the only idiotic cause supported by the left, that was meant as an illustration, unless the Republican Party grows a spine, and pushes back on the excessive grift from the Trump family this country is in shambles, I’m disappointed in both sides, this country is being destroyed by the extremes on both sides.
We need to get back to decency and the center, or this will not end well or soon.

"Also, you can't shoot through a door."

I mean if it's halfway kicked in, you can. Not saying the defendant's door was kicked in at all, just hypothetically speaking about Castle Doctrine laws but if someone is trying force their way into your "castle," then they've demonstrated a reasonable threat that can be met with deadly force in many states. The defendant's legal team is going to intentionally show that the lines can blur so that the jury can't reach a unanimous "guilty" verdict.

@Nina - Yeah. The rationale I got from the firearms lawyer here was that you don't know who you're shooting on the other side. If you can see them, if it's partway open, you're not shooting "through" the door.
If all this is on camera, the trial might be pretty short, either way.
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Whatever happens, the kid that got shot deserves a Darwin Award. Fucking dumbass.

@Nina
“ A neighbor's surveillance video showed the teens kicking and banging into the neighbor's garage door before the shooting took place. So they were doing more than just playing Ding Dong Ditch by the time the event took place. It's easy to assume people attempting to kick in your door at 3AM are doing something nefarious, and attempting to kick a door down is not a part of Ding Dong Ditch”

Do you have an actual news article that mentions that? Not just random people making stuff up on twitter.

Also the reason the incident happened in the “back of the yard” was supposedly because the kids ran there to try to escape. From what ive read, they werent trying to kick in a back door or do anything to a back door entrance.

Im curious if you or Icey would even change your mind at all even if it was certified and confirmed that they werent trying to kick in a back door?
I bring up the instance of cannon hinnant because i personally believe icey, and possibly you, fall into the crowd of people who cheered at and justified cannon hinnant being shot.

I personally think huge segments of society are racist, and a higher % of black people are racist than white people. Just like with karmelo anthony, ahmaud arbery, cannon hinnant, and this situation, anytime theres an inter racial incident, some people will simply support their favored race no matter what.

You appear to be doing that, with these completely made up claims of “kicking a door in”. At this point, we dont even know if the kid kicked the door once, let alone attempting to break down a back door. Im not sure where you got all your information from, it appears to be stuff people are claiming on reddit/twitter, not something actually stated on a news article.

“Kicking the door down” needs to be something a reasonable person would assume is someone attempting to break the door. So if there were a couple weak kicks followed by the kid running away, that wouldn’t justify lethal force.

IMO anyone providing input on cases like this should first be obligated to state their thoughts on people like dylan roof and micah xavier johnson, just to make sure people are even on the same page.
A rational person would condemn both those guys but there are segments of society who cheered for both of them. I suspect icey and possibly ninabambina cheered for micah xavier, which is the equivalent of someone cheering for dylan roof

Most people backing the homeowner appear to be people that also backed ahmaud arbery. Which is totally crazy because arbery was actually looting houses, whereas these kids were ringing bells. If you support arbery and also support this homeowner, you basically support a different set of rights for black and white people

^ I care about self-defense law and have actually completed courses on the topic.
That's all that matters.

Much of the reporting on the case is racist. The potential burglar is made out to be a good white 18 year old white "kid" just playing outside at 3am. Shot by a young black man with previous arrests.
Theyre going out of their way to humanize Bosworth. While showing Butlers mug shot.

If someone was kicking your door in at 3am youd be like its okay its just a young white guy playing? Haha hes so funny.

Not at all Icey, but we dont even know if there was any “kicking door in” going on. If someone rang my bell at 3am or kicked the door i would call the cops. Theres a huge difference between ringing the bell, kicking or knocking on a door, and attempting to break into a door. Attempting to break in would mean someone is using repeated full force kicks.
But still, what are your thoughts on cannon hinnant, ahmaud arbery, and micah xavier Johnson? I know you support arbery, im curious why do you believe it was wrong for arbery to be shot but okay for these kids to be shot, considering arbery was actually caught looting a house? It seems a little ridiculous to argue you can shoot someone for kicking a door or ringing a bell but not someone who was stealing

A lot of commentary you and Nina are stating is coming from the blackpeopletwitter and r/blackpeopletwitter. Ill point out that there is no white version of those groups/subreddit, its actually not allowed on both Reddit and twitter. So even if there is a mainstream media bias against black people, its easily countered by the anti white bias on reddit and possibly X

I got my info from actual news and case reports. Go troll someone else

What case reports? If you have actual news and case reports post them so everyone can access them. You cant, because its just commentary from people who also cheered for cannon hinnant and micah xavier johnson

You can Google. But like always you take a thread with potential and fuck it up with obnoxious trolling

"If someone rang my bell at 3am or kicked the door i would call the cops."
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I'd have the phone in one hand and my 12 gauge, shell in the chamber, finger on the safety, in another, and my "New York reload" (.357) in my pocket.
I'd yell I'm armed and ready to shoot.
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If they run away, I swallow my ego and send the videos to the cops, and if the video is clear enough, the brat's parents and school, with a stern warning that this wouldn't be the first time a TikTok challenge causes natural selection.
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If the lock breaks? KA-BLAM! shuc-shuc KA-BLAM! shuc-shuc until the threat stops.
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Call 911 and say "I was attacked, feared for my life, and had to defend myself."
Request both police and ambulance.
When the cops come, loudly announce where you are, point the gun away from them, and follow instructions.
Then say "I will cooperate 100% but first I need my attorney present."
(You could be like D'Angelo Barksdale and just repeat "lawyer, motherfucker!" but antagonizing the arresting officer is not wise.)
In any jurisdiction, all you need is one ambitious prosecutor to take things out of context.

Puddy fair enough, but i dont have a gun, lol!

"A lot of commentary you and Nina are stating is coming from the blackpeopletwitter and r/blackpeopletwitter. Ill point out that there is no white version of those groups/subreddit, its actually not allowed on both Reddit and twitter."

Thanks for letting me know what's going on at r/blackpeopletwitter, a place you clearly frequent for whatever reason. I don't know if I've ever read a single post from that subreddit. And it took me a few quick seconds to find out that there is indeed a r/whitepeopletwitter and it has 3 million users. Maybe they banned you, idk.

Nina, the funny thing is, whitepeopletwitter is actually a subreddit for making fun of white people. Unlike blackpeopletwitter, which is actually a pro black subreddit. So like I said, there isnt actually a whitepeopletwitter subreddit or twitter group.
Did you have fun celebrating the death of cannon hinnant, though? Im like, 95% certain you celebrated that and micah xavierjohnson and i like how you ignored that part of my post while only addressing the subreddit groups

I hope you genuinely werent aware of those groups otherwise its very disingenuous to present r/whitepeopletwitter as being the same as r/blackpeopletwitter. I get that the names are similar but both groups actually do the same thing. One is pro black the other is anti white. Im just pointing out the fact reddit doesnt allow pro white subreddits because its considered white supremacy, but they do allow pro black subreddits. Its similar to how pro BLM folk claim a white lives matter, hell even an all lives matter group is racist

I'm not familiar with the two people whose deaths you just mentioned. I think you spend a lot more time on this stuff than the average person.

You can google them. I believe you back both of them but just dont want to do so openly on here

Hes just doing some bad trolling

I've never been afraid to voice my opinion on here. You seem very unfamiliar with me.

good